I recognized the voice of the mysterious woman first time I saw the film. It's a kind of dissassociation from reality, and an obsessive flight of ideas, into endless, words and meta-words. >>>>>>>>>>> And why should anyone accept> anything Ziegler says, someone who contemptibly dismisses this woman> (or women) as "a hooker. - Zieglerwasn't concerned about her health, just eager to get rid of her so asto avoid any potential social embarrassment, "Bill, this is justbetween us"). But he can't know for sure (because she wasmasked at Somerton). > Its common sense he was referring to Somerton as the party. But I agree the way it is done is brilliant and it leaves all of us unsure of everything, opening up infinite possibilites as to what it all means. WebChords for Backward Priests, normal version of Masked Ball Eyes wide shut with lyrics. I had absolutely no idea you were involved in any way. and she > replies, "Better," and then when Bill says, "you are a very lucky girl," > Mandy says, "I know." In a buddhist sutra, Sakyamuni, criticized the compulsive mental masturbators and referred to them as people "counting ganges sands." > No, they aren't half whispered, they might be a little quiet but they aare > clear and she has a very distinctive voice. No, she clearly says "sorry" to Zeigler when he says "you gave us a scare kiddo" and then Bill asks her, "How are you feeling now Mandy?" I like the Ninth Gate alot and have watched it numerous times but it's quite a few notches below EWS. WebThe bodies of more completely nude masked women assail Bills voyeuristic eyes (and those of the audience). When Bill asks what, she simply responds, "Fuck." Eyes Wide Shut developed after Stanley Kubrick read Arthur Schnitzler's Dream Story in 1968, when Kubrick was looking for a project to follow 2001: A Space Odyssey. Kubrick was interested in adapting the story, and with the help of journalist Jay Cocks, bought the filming rights to the novel. Eyes Wide Shut is Stanley Kubrick's final movie starring Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman, but what does the mask on the pillow near the end mean? Indeed, he appearsthoroughly confused: later with Ziegler in the poolroom, he asks, "thewoman at the party is the woman lying dead in the morgue." >>>>>>>>>If this were really the> case, wouldn't Bill have recognised that voice when speaking to the> masked woman at Somerton, instead of asking her "Who are you?" <<<<<<<<<<. He's eventually discovered and forced to remove his mask but is saved from a bleak fate by another masked woman who tried to warn him to leave earlier. ANSWER. Ha ha hah, ha ha hah! He treated her as a not-very-importantpatient; no Mandys attend Bill's upmarket surgery. Interesting, when you search for "actress" in Google image search youget mostly kind of Indian looking women, After the party that Bill & his wife attended, Bill goes off on this solitary journey without her, through the streets and roads of New York State, to have his violent and erotic adventures. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<, ME> You can identify Pollack's eyes and chin quite easily in the close ups.>. Rather, he> is beginning to SUSPECT that the body might be that of the masked> woman, a suspician that leads him to look long and hard at her up> close in the morgue. <<<<<<<<. <<<<<<<<<<<>. > it is clearly the same voice as the "mysterious woman." When Bill thinks hes just about to score his own sexual liaison, his charade is exposed. The way Zeigler confirms it was Mandy is matter of fact and it isn't as though Bill seemed surprised at this--even if the audience might still be confused. Now that's out of the way, a brief introduction. > It's totally clear the "party' in this reference, is Somerton. --alt.flame Special Forces"All successful software gets changed." WebSynopsis. When Bill goes to the hospital, he asks to see patient Amanda Curren (sp), the name he saw in the newspaper. You can identify Pollacks eyes and chin quite easily in the close ups. She helps Bill at the >What else could he call it? That is what she was" implying that her death> is of no consequence because of the low-status manner in which Ziegler> chooses to define her (an identity created and perpetuated by the> Zieglers of the world in the first place), earlier confirmed by his> desire to get the drugged-out Mandy out of his bathroom and house> ("Can we put some clothes on her and get her out of here?" ">> "Victor what can I say. Are we not acceptingZiegle'sr story here once again, and then retrospectivelyinterpellating and internalising it, re-interpreting all the earlierevents of the film in strict accordance with his frankly deeplysuspect account? How doesshe know this? It's profoundly, structurally, indeterminate >>> 1. so drugged out as to have been clearly incapable of making sense ofanything and 2. never actually spoke (just some unintelligiblemumbling),<<<. >He also must have recognized the voice, considering that her voice is >somewhat deep and throaty with a tinge of distinctive accent. WebEyes Wide Shut Mask Woman - Etsy Browse a wide selection of eyes wide shut mask woman and face coverings available in various fabrics and configurations, made by a What does the mask on the pillow at the end of Eyes Wide Shutmean? When he gets to Somerton, they are all wearing the same kind of costume--Nick only tells him, they are "costumed and masked." Amazing. >on the balcony looking down> at Bill, knows that it is him and nodded to him. 1. In the spur of the moment people might first recognize voices, subliminally. The movie is based on the 1920's novella Dream Storyand Kubrick developed the project for decades, and once considered a slightly more comedic take with Steve Martin in the lead role. The film centers on a profoundly unsatisfied couple tied together not by pure love, but by social convenience and appearances. Was she the women at the party?" <<<<<<<<< He didn't recognise her voice. When I did this, at first it seems like a similar, but different face, but then seeing one frame of the bathroom scene from a certain angle, it jumped out at me that it was the same person, but I could be wrong. It is odd that Bill would remember his patient he hadn't seen in at least a year, owned "Rainbow Fashions?" Ironically, that is just what power (and Ziegler)would want you to believe - that the world of power and power elitesdoesn't exist, is just all a charade anyway, that those who dorecognise the realities of social power and of desire are justparanoid conspiracy nutters (when in fact it is those whoattribute all that occurs in the film to 'a dream' who are beingproperly paranoid). NG was :>the realization of that potential. In a big crowd of masked people, Zeigler (his eyes give away who he is) on the balcony looking down at Bill, knows that it is him and nodded to him. Bill was not yet sure it was Mandy from the bathroom, till he happened to see the news story and saw the name "Amanda," then it started to come together. All of this could have been set up by Alice, who asks, Bill in the beginning, "why do you think Zeigler invites us to these? > it is clearly the same voice as the "mysterious woman." ---people with no idea of the futility and silliness of counting endless grains of sands, with their mental masturbations and perserverations. Please either stop > or> shape up. It is also possible that for some reason Kubrick had to hire a different person to double for Mandy. Its common sense he was referring to Somerton as the party. >>on the balcony looking down at Bill, knows that it is him and nodded to >>him. Again, is this not another case of'fantasmatic inflation', of imagining this figure to be Ziegler simplybecause of what we subsequently learn about him in the poolroom scene?And why should it matter WHO this figure is, beyond being a member ofthe power elite? Orgy? Desire is always the desire of theOther our dreams constituring the realisation of desire. Obviously in your literal, fundamentalist world, the concepts ofmetaphor and metonomy are similarly too much for you to possiblycomprehend, viz >> I'm sorry, but this has to be said: I'm pretty sure I know what you mean,> but the way you're saying it is silly. It was a party nevertheless. It's just idiotic. But then, Ziegler's 'explanation', his retconningof past events, only serves to further propel Bill into subjectivedestitution, another 'replay' of Bill's unmasking at Somerton, Zieglerpower-presiding over Bill's position and status at a red pool-tablemuch like Red Cloak presided over the power ritual on a red carpet atSomerton. Even though much was 'cleared" up there are still major mysteries here that unless they are encoded in single frames for analyssis will alwasy be a mystery. Here was Stanley Kubrick, for many the worlds greatest living filmmaker, returning with his first finished project in 12 years a sexually provocative adult drama, utterly shrouded in secrecy, starring pre-eminent Hollywood power couple Tom In contrast to the Ziegler-Bill poolroom scene clearing up allambiguities (Ziegler's seeming 'commonsensical' and desublimating'explanation' of the Somerton ritual), as many have complained in thepast, this scene instead multiplies and amplifies the uncertainties.Ziegler in this scene, as in earlier ones, seams to be simultaneouslysaying two contradictory things - a deadlock of entrapment: he triesto completely shut down the question surrounding the extent to whichthe whole Somerton ritual was 'merely' a theatrical 'charade' byinsisting - to Bill - that it was precisely nothing more than a merecharade, a mere trivial irrelevance. > certainly not by Bill) as a 'party. I am normally the last guy in theworld to criticize somebody for using big words, but, besides that you'renot bothering, even, to use them correctly, the way that you are using themserves to obfuscate rather than clarify your meaning. > Similarly, when Bill reads the media report about an Amanda Curran> suffering a drug overdose in a hotel, why does he immediately make a> connection with his own recent experiences (and in a coffee shop/cafe> that set-wise is actually the very same building that earlier served> as Millich's Rainbow Fashions)? If it was all a elaborate part of Bill's initiation into the order. 2. The goal of yoga practice was to STOP all that useless babble---because that is how a person actually makes the breakthrough to see reality as it is. Superman movies must keep him in the pre 80s, or he needsto do some serious upgrading. -- Steven L.Email: [email protected], http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oB6g66OYoKI, "Steven L." wrote in message. Please either stop orshape up. Those critics of EWS must have been delerious. ", "Victor what can I say. - Ziegler> wasn't concerned about her health, just eager to get rid of her so as> to avoid any potential social embarrassment, "Bill, this is just> between us").>>> What is interesting is that the film's very ambiguity concerning the> identities of the three women (Mandy, masked woman, woman in morgue),> sets up a desire to 'fill in' all the film's narrative gaps and> deadlocks, a desire to shut down such uncertainty, to give - just like> Ziegler - an easy, 'commonsensical' black and white 'explanation' of> events. Crumb Eye. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<. I'm your Mutineer~ - Warren Zevon- -. We need some upstart director and SK devotee who can channel SK, to Make EWS part 2. What's going on?>> Wasn't the woman in the mask a lot skinnier than the ODd woman?? And why should anyone acceptanything Ziegler says, someone who contemptibly dismisses this woman(or women) as "a hooker. And the redeemer's pubic hair is also trimmed the same. "you are going to need some rehab," she says, "I > know.". Carolin Ruwe, in her book Symbols in Stanley Kubrick's Movie 'Eyes Wide Shut', argues that the mask is the prime symbol of the film. While the final movie was greeted with somewhat mixed reviews at the time, the appreciation for Eyes Wide Shut has only grown since its 1999 debut. ", > I'm sorry, but this has to be said: I'm pretty sure I know what you, > mean,> but the way you're saying it is silly. However, the lack of one may have saved the life of gangster Vincent (Mad Dog) Coll (various movies). The official cause of death was from a heart attack. A part-time hobby soon blossomed into a career when he discovered he really loved writing about movies, TV and video games; he even (arguably) had a little bit of talent for it. Take another listen. I am normally the last guy in the, > world to criticize somebody for using big words. But he can't know for sure (because she was> masked at Somerton).>, >> The vagueness is intentional, but I think it is clear that it was Mandy >> all along,>>, > If it is vague, then how can it also be 'clear'? > People often don't make definitive connections between things at the > moment. (meaning the Mysterious woman) "victor the woman lying dead at the morgue was the women at the party, well victor, maybe i'm missing something heyou call it a Charadetell me what kind of Charade ends up with someone dead.". And the Somerton ritual is alsoambiguous; how, or rather why, for instance, does the masked womanupon first meeting the masked Bill, assert with such certainty that"You shouldn't be here", then followed by repeated warnings that hiscontinued presence at the ritual will get him in trouble? I think this feeling of > guilt and outrage at a murder, would be the first thing on his mind. He was a master ofthatslight of hand stuff. >>What else could he call it? The "over the rainbow" remark earlier at Zeigler's party was already a suggestion for Bill to think of his patient who owned "Rainbow Fashions." If it is vague, then how can it also be 'clear'? and then Bill says, "..you can't keep doing >> this," Mandy says, "Ya." I am ready > the same time, being simple and concrete. Was she the women at the party?" Yes, the uncertainty about the identities of the women is Structuralto the film's splintered narrative. Imay bewrong, but I think Kubrick intended it that way. WebThere are constant hints throughout the film of it being a story about one man's ego and insecurities. He did not know who she was: she was wearinga mask. I found them both disappointing. Indeed, the film iscentrally concerned with the failure of a 'male-centric' andpatriarchal ideology to deal with female desire; and the narrativethrust of the film revolves around Bill's increasingly hopelessefforts to flee from (but also to copy and avenge) Alice's desire, adesire from which he is completely excluded, just as he is laterexcluded from the desire-space of the power-elite at Somerton. So maybe they were all wearing walkie talkies under those masks, what do you want me to say..no, this IS left as a huge mystery. > > On Jan 11, 6:50 am, dumb_n00b wrote: > > This may indeed be the case, but within the diagetic space of the film. He wasn't positive. They paid off the desk cleark to tell Bill, that Nick was being roughed up, or perhaps the clerk is one of those men dancing with men at the ceremony/orgy and in fact Mandy, although on the slab was not really dead. First of all, Mandy must have felt some connection with Bill since he was showing her concern and kindness in the Bathroom. I agree though, he hadnt made a defintiive connection yet. And didn't Ziegler subsequently admit that the Somerton peopleonly learned of Bill's identity as a result of becoming suspicious ofhis manner of arrival and the costume-rental receipt in his coatpocket? He only ultimately accepts Ziegler's account because it> gives him a convenient alibi (as well as because of Ziegler's powerful> position - Bill is Ziegler's man, obeying his orders, subscribing to> the demands and realities of Ziegler's world). reinforced bythe simple observation that you have never actually posted here before[at least under your supplied handle/ID]. Many of the nude women begin pairing up with the fully-clothed men, and the orgy begins in nearly full view. reinforced bythe simple observation that you have never actually posted here before[at least under your supplied handle/ID]. Ironically, that is just what power (and Ziegler)> would want you to believe - that the world of power and power elites> doesn't exist, is just all a charade anyway, that those who do> recognise the realities of social power and of desire are just> paranoid conspiracy nutters (when in fact it is those who> attribute all that occurs in the film to 'a dream' who are being> properly paranoid). If he were> Ziegler, wouldn't he instead be going out of his way to privately> communicate with Bill, to get Bill out of Somerton as quickly as> possible in order to avoid any possible trouble (and as Ziegler> subsequently admits, Bill's gate-crashing 'made me look like a> complete fool')? WebEyes Wide Shut. Nevertheless, those two recollections(one of a fantasy, one of a dream) constitute the very desire whoseexclusion (from the quotidian, commonsensical, 'social reality' of theHarfords' marriage) the film is exploring. Sure, but they are half-whispered utterances from a woman in adepressed, semi-conscious state after suffering a potentially lethaldrug overdose. There's like a billion posts here at alt.movies.kubrick and you cansearch the archives for this information. ", "I saw her body in the morgue. WebOne of the masked women warns him he is in terrible danger. Eyes Wide Shut: What The Mask On The Pillow Means, Every Stanley Kubrick Movie Ranked, Worst To Best, The Shining: Why Stanley Kubrick Changed Stephen King's Story, Why Pirates of the Caribbean Producer Wants Johnny Depp Back, Chris Pratt Joins Luigi Actor To Troll Super Mario Bros. Movie Voice Critics. If we try to go too far in figuring out the film we are left with many mysteries. And if it's *not* supposed to be obvious, thatmeans that Polanski screwed up. How? The Redeemer's voice does sound alot like Mandy's voice, both with a hint of a New York accent. >>>>>>>>>How would he recognise him, know him, given that they were all >>>>>>>>>wearingmasks? :>released around the same time, The Ninth Gate. Clearly, of course,the Somerton ritual is a mirror of Ziegler's party (with each event inmany ways serving as the 'truth' of the other): whether its Mandy atthe party or at the ritual or at both, the outcome is still the same:a corpse in a morgue. And Milich was expecting him. He had no reason to think Zeigler was at Somerton, till Zeigler tells him. The second half of Eyes Wide Shut sees Bill being given ominous warnings from this secret society, and he can't seem to find his mask from the party. >Bill was not yet sure it was Mandy from the bathroom, till he happened to >see the news story and saw the name "Amanda," then it started to come >together. >He also must have recognized> the voice, considering that her voice is somewhat deep and throaty with a> tinge of distinctive accent. because Bill didn't get to see him up close like the film audience. > Mandy was not the same woman. that Bill first makes this connection, or at least, hasit confirmed by someone else (Ziegler)", Ditto. Well thats all true, but of course that was SK making a masterpiece and one of the most amazing films ever made IMO. Perhaps it> would have worked better if there had been a photo in the news> article. From his meeting with Ziegler in the poolroom, it appears that Billhas been unclear about the identity of the woman in the morgue via-a-vis Mandy and the masked woman. The vagueness is intentional, but I think it is clear that it was Mandy all along, although apparently there was a body double for some scenes. Barcaluv. > Sure, but they are half-whispered utterances from a woman in a> depressed, semi-conscious state after suffering a potentially lethal> drug overdose. <<<<<<<<<<. (4) With many people using Google maps-gps/satellite views scouring the earth, his Fortress of Solitude could be exposed. > anything and 2. never actually spoke (just some unintelligible > mumbling),<<<, > No, she clearly says "sorry" to Zeigler when he says "you gave us a scare > kiddo" and then Bill asks her, "How are you feeling now Mandy?" Tragically it was the director's final film with Kubrick dying less than a week after screening an incomplete cut for the studio and its stars. But then again when Superman puts on a pair of plain eyeglassesLois Lane, or anyone else fails to recognize him as Clark Kent! In contrast, why does the masked woman seeminglyalready know much more than they do? Again, how is it 'clearly' the same voice? <<<<<<< women there know that there was an interloper? WebSleep Mask for Women, Eye Mask for Sleeping Blindfold Block Out Light and Relieves Dry Eyes with Extra Gel Beads Pad,Super Smooth and Flower Patterns 4.4 4.4 out of 5 stars So is Ziegler lying? and she replies, "Better," and then when Bill says, "you are a very lucky girl," Mandy says, "I know." I am still on the side of those who think SK left that scene of the reflection of the sound man holding the boom mike at his crotch, in the crome tub enclosure, on purpose, that the DVD edited out. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<. I recognized the voice of the > mysterious woman first time I saw the film.>>, >> it is clearly the same voice as the "mysterious woman." Somerton could hardly be> >>>>>> described (and>> certainly not by Bill) as a 'party. '<<<<<<<<<<< I think it is clear he was > referring to the Somerton party. Lets look at the basic plot of this film. Bill has not made any definitive connection at that stage between> Mandy and the masked woman, only - at most - between Mandy and the> Amanda from the news report, both of them having suffered drug> overdoses. I think the voice would have rung a bell and the Newspaper story rang a bell, with the name Amanda, and of course seeing the corpse of someone who may have sacrificed her life for him--so he was in shock. it is clearly the same voice as the "mysterious woman." Models at the party attended by the Royal Family. Web .

1925 . Masks - both literal and figurative - are a major motif, and one of the most important sequences is when Bill infiltrates a masked sex party at a remote mansion, which is being held by members of high society. (Just like we dream alone, even if we're in bed with someone else.). One of the most fascinating feature films ever made, the revered auteurs final effort is notorious in every sense of the word. What a joke to call them "philosophers." He could choose to call it many things, but 'party'? Not only are they the REAL "anti-intellectuals," they were schizoid as hell and projected it onto the social mess, creating political gibberish, that has NO usefulness to anyone. Ironically, that is just what power (and Ziegler)would want you to believe - that the world of power and power elitesdoesn't exist, is just all a charade anyway, that those who dorecognise the realities of social power and of desire are justparanoid conspiracy nutters (when in fact it is those whoattribute all that occurs in the film to 'a dream' who are beingproperly paranoid). The lost of public phones booths will kill off Superman, Dr. Who, and Colin Farrell roles. "Kelpzoidzl" wrote in message news:[email protected] "Kelpzoidzl" wrote in message. What a mish mash of mentalmasturbation that is..", " Psycho-semi-freudian-lacanisn-junkie-marxist babbling. People often don't make definitive connections between things at the moment. When we see the naked corpse's face from the overhead shot, at first it's hard to tell if it's really Mandy's face, because of the expression and the angle, her combed back hair etc. But examine the frame showing the overhead shot in the morgue, with all the shots of Mandy in the bathroom. So why didn't Bill also recognise the identity of this masked figureon the basis of his eyes? Put on some headphones and listen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AzOnnrAlE8, http://www.celebsvideoarchive.com/videos/Julienne%20Davis/index.html, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvNO0BfBecc. "you are going to need some rehab," she says, >> "I know.">. He only ultimately acceptsZiegler's account because itgives him a convenient alibi (as well as because of Ziegler's powerfulposition - Bill is Ziegler's man, obeying his orders, subscribing tothe demands and realities of Ziegler's world). > I am still on the side of those who think SK left that scene of the > reflection of the sound man holding the boom mike at his crotch, in the > crome tub enclosure, on purpose, that the DVD edited out. One intriguing reading of the Eyes Wide Shut mask being on the pillow is that it's only in Bill's head as if he's exhausted by trying to hide his attempts at infidelity or true feelings from Alice, leading to an emotional breakdown. Masturbators and referred to them as people `` counting ganges sands. a notches. That it is odd that Bill would remember his patient he had no reason to think Zeigler was Somerton... > guilt and outrage at a murder, would be the first eyes wide shut who was the masked woman on his mind a kind of from... 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